From braumann at uni-leipzig.de Tue Dec 2 03:09:41 2014 From: braumann at uni-leipzig.de (Ulf-Dietrich Braumann) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] advanced bouncing Message-ID: Hello, is there a way to bounce a set of selected messages using a specific role? Thanks - UD From alandhae at gmx.de Tue Dec 2 03:26:20 2014 From: alandhae at gmx.de (alandhae@gmx.de) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] advanced bouncing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, Ulf-Dietrich Braumann wrote: Hi, > is there a way to bounce a set of selected messages using a specific role? try using # B and select role will be working, when specific roles have been defined Ciao Andreas -- Andreas Landh?u?er +49 151 12133027 (mobile) alandhae@gmx.de From braumann at uni-leipzig.de Tue Dec 2 04:32:44 2014 From: braumann at uni-leipzig.de (Ulf-Dietrich Braumann) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] advanced bouncing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, alandhae@gmx.de wrote: > ... > > try using > > # B and select role > > will be working, when specific roles have been defined > > ... Have you really tried out what you have proposed? Only that particular message which is highlighted that moment when you press # is being bounced after pressing B and subsequently selecting a role. But not those messages which were selected e.g. by pressing : (then labelled with an X sign). That is why have asked my question. Greetings - UD From alandhae at gmx.de Tue Dec 2 04:42:12 2014 From: alandhae at gmx.de (alandhae@gmx.de) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] advanced bouncing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, Ulf-Dietrich Braumann wrote: Oh, never tried to use this on a bunch of messages, sorry about the misunderstanding Ciao Andreas > On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, alandhae@gmx.de wrote: > >> ... >> >> try using >> >> # B and select role >> >> will be working, when specific roles have been defined >> >> ... > > Have you really tried out what you have proposed? Only that particular > message which is highlighted that moment when you press # is being bounced > after pressing B and subsequently selecting a role. But not those messages > which were selected e.g. by pressing : (then labelled with an X sign). That > is why have asked my question. > > Greetings - UD > > > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > -- Andreas Landh?u?er +49 151 12133027 (mobile) alandhae@gmx.de From lucio at lambrate.inaf.it Wed Dec 3 01:49:05 2014 From: lucio at lambrate.inaf.it (Lucio Chiappetti) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] advanced bouncing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, Ulf-Dietrich Braumann wrote: > On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, alandhae@gmx.de wrote: > >> try using >> # B and select role > Have you really tried out what you have proposed? I have never realized that # B did exist or work and in fact it does not work at all for me (# puts me in the role selection menu and then into compose new message) I tried that one can bounce a group of selected messages (with A B) but than I am not offered a possibility to change role. I tried that one can FORWARD a group of messages (with A F) and that can be done also as a MIME digest (which is handy if the people at the other end are smart enough and have a smart enough client like Alpine). In this case it asks me to select the role ... at least in the case I tried, replying to alpine list message triggers a rule which sets a specific role. I have just checked M S R R and seen that at the bottom of the role rule there are options for the case of Reply, Forward and Compose but not Bounce. My role has indicated to be activated in Reply without confirmation in Forward with confirmation in Compose never I wonder whether compose covers also bounce ... apparently not -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Bassini 15 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Do not like Firefox >=29 ? Get Pale Moon ! http://www.palemoon.org From cazzola at di.unimi.it Wed Dec 3 07:27:57 2014 From: cazzola at di.unimi.it (Walter Cazzola) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode Message-ID: Dear Alpine Experts, I'm used to access newsgroups through alpine with satisfaction. To do that I've a leafnode server installed on my machine. Recently I've reinstalled my machine with Fedora 20 and since then alpine refuses to connect to the leafnode server with the message: 400 NNTP connection broken (response) the leafnode server seems running since it replies to telnet as: >telnet localhost 119 Trying ::1... Connected to localhost. Escape character is '^]'. 200 Leafnode NNTP Daemon, version 1.11.8 running at localhost and also fetchnews seems doing its work: >fetchnews -vv leafnode 1.11.8: verbosity level is 2, debugmode is 1 try_lock(timeout=5), fqdn="localhost" news.aioe.org: connecting to port nntp... news.aioe.org: connected to 94.75.214.39:119, reply: 200 news.aioe.org: connected. news.aioe.org: using STAT command. news.aioe.org: 0 articles posted. news.aioe.org: getting new newsgroups news.aioe.org: got 0 new newsgroups. news.aioe.org: reading server info from /var/spool/news/leaf.node/news.aioe.org news.aioe.org: conversation completed, disconnected. wrote active file with 29454 lines Started process to update overview data in the background. Network activity has finished. Even if without a client I can't subscribe any group but the list of the groups available on the remote server is correctly in /var/spool/news/leaf.node/groupinfo In the .pinerc I've: nntp-server=localhost:119 folder-collections=Mail mail/[], {127.0.0.1/nntp}#news.[] and in general the content of the .pinerc didn't change between the two installations of the machine. Currently I'm using leafnode-1.11.8-11.fc20.x86_64 alpine-2.11-1.fc20.x86_64 /etc/leafnode belongs to news.news and my user is in the group news. I don't have any idea about how to solve the problem. Also googling around on the error message I didn't find anything useful. Do you have any idea? Thank you in advance for your time. Best Regards Walter -- From braumann at uni-leipzig.de Wed Dec 3 07:47:23 2014 From: braumann at uni-leipzig.de (Ulf-Dietrich Braumann) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] advanced bouncing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Dec 2014, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: > I have never realized that # B did exist or work and in fact it does not > work at all for me (# puts me in the role selection menu and then into > compose new message) I think you need to turn on the following switch in order get the "# B", "# R", "# F", and "# C" keystroke sequences working: [X] Alternate Role (#) Menu As far as I can see using this alternate role menu one refers to the presently highlighted message. And yes, if messages are selected, when pressing "A R" or "A F" one subsequently will be able to select a role via Ctrl-T, (whereas in both cases one more or less will create a new message). I guess there is some good reason for not offering role selection after "A B", but I do not have enough insight. Greetings - UD From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Wed Dec 3 18:36:01 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-03 16:27, Walter Cazzola wrote: > In the .pinerc I've: > > nntp-server=localhost:119 folder-collections=Mail mail/[], > {127.0.0.1/nntp}#news.[] I checked mine, which was not working. By comparison with another machine, I got it working again this way: nntp-server=localhost news-collections="Local News" {localhost/nntp}#news.[], Direct Mail/[] on another machine I have: news-collections="Local News" {localhost/nntp}#news.[] I don't remember why I have that "Direct Mail/" collection in there, seems an error. But it does retrieve my mail folder. And the "Local News" collection does display my leafnode content. You have first to use "add" to add folders. However, I don't like how pine/alpine handles nntp, because it does not keep track of what posts I read and which not. It is next to useless to me this way. They told me to "simply delete" the posts I read, but that means that I can not read them again, like email in a thread. That's why I now use Thunderbird a lot. :-( - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlR/yI8ACgkQtTMYHG2NR9VPgwCfaIWo8dyY8KmKMBckpjs6XPsh d6wAn3nWQNPSU70r2LofekAtgfIbLFuc =RPy3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Wed Dec 3 23:53:48 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > From: Carlos E. R. > To: Alpine-info > Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2014 02:36:01 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode > > On 2014-12-03 16:27, Walter Cazzola wrote: > > > In the .pinerc I've: > > > > nntp-server=localhost:119 folder-collections=Mail mail/[], > > {127.0.0.1/nntp}#news.[] > > I checked mine, which was not working. By comparison with another > machine, I got it working again this way: > > nntp-server=localhost > > news-collections="Local News" {localhost/nntp}#news.[], > Direct Mail/[] > > on another machine I have: > > news-collections="Local News" {localhost/nntp}#news.[] > > > I don't remember why I have that "Direct Mail/" collection in there, > seems an error. But it does retrieve my mail folder. And the "Local > News" collection does display my leafnode content. You have first to > use "add" to add folders. If you specify: nntp-server=localhost then you may not need to specify a News collection. From the help for the "nntp-server" parameter: When you define an NNTP server here, Alpine implicitly defines a news collection for you, assuming that server as the news server and assuming that you will use the NNTP protocol and a local newsrc configuration file for reading news. For more about reading news with Alpine, see how to use Alpine to read news. This is what I have set up on my Unix boxes, and it works fine using my .newsrc file to pick up the Newsgroups I read. (I don't use leafnode. I have stunnel listening on the loopback address and forwarding local connections as encrypted connections to one of the free News servers. But the principle is the same.) > However, I don't like how pine/alpine handles nntp, because it > does not keep track of what posts I read and which not. It is next > to useless to me this way. > > They told me to "simply delete" the posts I read, but that means > that I can not read them again, like email in a thread. > > That's why I now use Thunderbird a lot. :-( I also usually use a dedicated News reader. It's trn in my case. But there's a choice of quite a few. I quite like knews as a graphical interface to News. -- Dennis Davis From cazzola at di.unimi.it Thu Dec 4 00:46:43 2014 From: cazzola at di.unimi.it (Walter Cazzola) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: Hi Carlos, all, I got some improvements, thanks to your suggestions On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > news-collections="Local News" {localhost/nntp}#news.[] by adding this line to the .pinerc now my old subscriptions are back and the error message disappeared but even if fetchnews command now downloads the newsgroups messages >fetchnews -vv leafnode 1.11.8: verbosity level is 2, debugmode is 1 try_lock(timeout=5), fqdn="localhost" news.aioe.org: connecting to port nntp... news.aioe.org: connected to 94.75.214.39:119, reply: 200 news.aioe.org: connected. news.aioe.org: using STAT command. news.aioe.org: 0 articles posted. news.aioe.org: getting new newsgroups news.aioe.org: got 0 new newsgroups. news.aioe.org: reading server info from /var/spool/news/leaf.node/news.aioe.org it.comp.os.linux.software: skipping articles 1-3164 inclusive (article limit) it.comp.os.linux.software: considering articles 5139 - 5165 it.comp.os.linux.software: 0 articles fetched, 13 killed it.comp.software.tex: skipping articles 1-977 inclusive (article limit) it.comp.software.tex: considering articles 2972 - 2978 it.comp.software.tex: 1 article fetched, 5 killed comp.text.tex: skipping articles 1-48900 inclusive (article limit) comp.text.tex: considering articles 50104 - 50901 comp.text.tex: 66 articles fetched, 484 killed news.aioe.org: conversation completed, disconnected. wrote active file with 29454 lines Started process to update overview data in the background. Network activity has finished. none of the fetched articles is in the corresponding folder, i.e., alpine shows an empty folder when I get into the folder of e.g., comp.text.tex in spite of the fact that 66 articles have been fetched. Any idea about how to solve the issue? Walter. -- From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Thu Dec 4 02:11:10 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Walter Cazzola wrote: > From: Walter Cazzola > To: Carlos E. R. > Cc: Alpine-info > Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2014 08:46:43 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode > > Hi Carlos, all, > > I got some improvements, thanks to your suggestions > > On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > > > news-collections="Local News" {localhost/nntp}#news.[] > > by adding this line to the .pinerc now my old subscriptions are back and > the error message disappeared but even if fetchnews command now > downloads the newsgroups messages > > >fetchnews -vv > leafnode 1.11.8: verbosity level is 2, debugmode is 1 > try_lock(timeout=5), fqdn="localhost" > news.aioe.org: connecting to port nntp... ... > Started process to update overview data in the background. > Network activity has finished. > > none of the fetched articles is in the corresponding folder, i.e., > alpine shows an empty folder when I get into the folder of e.g., > comp.text.tex in spite of the fact that 66 articles have been fetched. > > Any idea about how to solve the issue? Wild guess: Alpine uses your ~/.newsrc file to track which articles you've seen (deleted and expunged in Alpine parlance). This makes alpine compatible with other Newsreaders. For example, my .newsrc file starts: comp.mail.pine: 1-1768 alt.sysadmin.recovery: 1-27792 indicating which articles I've seen in the above Newsgroups. Does your .newsrc file indicate that you've already seen the articles you're downloading ? Might be worth saving a copy of your current .newsrc file and starting with a test .newsrc that doesn't contain any article numbers. Ie a bare file containg just Newsgroup names, eg: comp.mail.pine: alt.sysadmin.recovery: (I believe you need to include a trailing space after the colon (:)) ...I also read News from news.aioe.org. Alpine should work fine connecting directly to news.aioe.org. You could consider cutting out the middleman -- fetchnews -- and connect directly to news.aioe.org. At the very least, it's just one less thing to potentially go wrong. -- Dennis Davis From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Thu Dec 4 05:54:25 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-04 08:53, Dennis Davis wrote: > On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > If you specify: > > nntp-server=localhost > > then you may not need to specify a News collection. From the help > for the "nntp-server" parameter: Maybe. I think it did not work when I first tried years ago, so I have the collection set. > (I don't use leafnode. I have stunnel listening on the loopback > address and forwarding local connections as encrypted connections > to one of the free News servers. But the principle is the same.) Curious. >> However, I don't like how pine/alpine handles nntp, because it >> does not keep track of what posts I read and which not. It is >> next to useless to me this way. >> >> They told me to "simply delete" the posts I read, but that means >> that I can not read them again, like email in a thread. >> >> That's why I now use Thunderbird a lot. :-( > > I also usually use a dedicated News reader. It's trn in my case. > But there's a choice of quite a few. I quite like knews as a > graphical interface to News. trn? It is not available on my distribution. So I tried to build it myself. It asks an awful lot of questions, not a standard "configure" program. Apparently it makes decisions at build time instead of run time, which makes sense for slow machines, but not for modern machines. And then "make" crashed. Not really important, but I was curious to try it. For the curious, the error was this: cer@Telcontar:~/Compilaciones/nntp/trn-4.0-test77> make cc -c -O -I/usr/local/include addng.c In file included from addng.c:20:0: term.h:171:1: error: expected identifier or ?(? before ?...? token ..."Don't know how to define the term macros!" ^ make: *** [addng.o] Error 1 cer@Telcontar:~/Compilaciones/nntp/trn-4.0-test77> Oh well. Is it similar to slrn? The slrn program deletes posts you read, as Pine does, and I hate that. Back to pan, knode, thunderbird... they work as expected. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlSAZ5AACgkQtTMYHG2NR9WdNgCfSO9ZJ2Rt4uiuYleBUp5fHjtp c1QAnRHLbhIc8TGbSrEIs0q6dTMDan5w =dgy0 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From damion.yates at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 09:52:19 2014 From: damion.yates at gmail.com (Damion Yates) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > On 2014-12-04 08:53, Dennis Davis wrote: [snipped] > > I also usually use a dedicated News reader. It's trn in my case. > > But there's a choice of quite a few. I quite like knews as a > > graphical interface to News. > > trn? It is not available on my distribution. So I tried to build it > myself. > Is it similar to slrn? The slrn program deletes posts you read, as > Pine does, and I hate that. > > Back to pan, knode, thunderbird... they work as expected. I always used "tin" maybe that's on your dist or compiles better. I recall not having problems with its remembering read vs unread. I stopped frequenting Usenet years ago, not enough time :( - Damion From cazzola at di.unimi.it Thu Dec 4 10:29:14 2014 From: cazzola at di.unimi.it (Walter Cazzola) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: Hi Dennis, all, On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Dennis Davis wrote: >> none of the fetched articles is in the corresponding folder, i.e., >> alpine shows an empty folder when I get into the folder of e.g., >> comp.text.tex in spite of the fact that 66 articles have been fetched. > Wild guess: > Alpine uses your ~/.newsrc file to track which articles you've > seen (deleted and expunged in Alpine parlance). This makes alpine > compatible with other Newsreaders. For example, my .newsrc file > starts: > comp.mail.pine: 1-1768 > alt.sysadmin.recovery: 1-27792 > indicating which articles I've seen in the above Newsgroups. > Does your .newsrc file indicate that you've already seen the > articles you're downloading ? Your "wild guess" was correct! I cancelled my old .newsrc relinked some newsgroups and the messages are there. Just for the records, now, alpine is creating a .newsrc-?name of the host? file instead of .newsrc > ...I also read News from news.aioe.org. Alpine should work > fine connecting directly to news.aioe.org. You could consider > cutting out the middleman -- fetchnews -- and connect directly to > news.aioe.org. At the very least, it's just one less thing to > potentially go wrong. I will give it a try. Thanks a lot. Walter -- From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Thu Dec 4 11:03:56 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> Message-ID: <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-04 18:52, Damion Yates wrote: > On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > I always used "tin" maybe that's on your dist or compiles better. > I recall not having problems with its remembering read vs unread. > Yes, that one is available. I think I tried it years ago, I forgot what I thought of it :-} I'll try again. Mmm... it wants mutt as a dependency. I don't like mutt. > I stopped frequenting Usenet years ago, not enough time :( Ha, it is not usenet, it is the opensuse.org forum. Instead of using the http interface, I use the nntp gateway, which allows me to read an post using a news reader. It is the only web forum I know with this feature, and it is wonderful. Ok, tried tin. I know why I do not use it: it does not remember read posts: it deletes them! Same as Pine does, and the others. The second time I visit a group, it is completely empty, and I can not work that way. I need to see all posts, old and new, read or not, distinguish them all, and sort according to those properties if I wish, same as with email. All graphical nntp readers do this (they keep a local cache), but no text mode reader does. Or none I know. Pity. However, Pine has a feature that Thunderbird or others do not have: body text search on nntp. I had not noticed this feature previously, and it is something I needed. I'm surprised! :-o Of course, with a remote nntp server, it causes a tremendous traffic, as it has to download all posts, and caches none. As I have a local machine leafnode server, I do not care :-) Good! I learned something new and useful today :-) - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlSAsBgACgkQtTMYHG2NR9VdvACcCMuSJ5PiX5dKF3iK02P94+Ct h/sAn3T2a3jW95TFVGgyGQakDgZvKfsR =J7OI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Thu Dec 4 11:19:51 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: <5480B3D7.8010707@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-04 19:29, Walter Cazzola wrote: >> ...I also read News from news.aioe.org. Alpine should work fine >> connecting directly to news.aioe.org. You could consider cutting >> out the middleman -- fetchnews -- and connect directly to >> news.aioe.org. At the very least, it's just one less thing to >> potentially go wrong. > > I will give it a try. In my experience, having leafnode speeds things terribly. Of course, there is a lag when new posts appear upstream; but you can browse posts with tremendous speed. And I just found a feature Pine has: it can search nntp text content o the entire folder, which is done fetching and reading the thousands of posts in the nntp server. This is practical against a local leafnode, but not against a remote server. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlSAs9MACgkQtTMYHG2NR9WaxACgjq5zGKGnLVHs4kc9LV+7b3Qm jgIAn1NKBZ7NSwSQh1LIg9cQ3V2tct4R =/Xjv -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Thu Dec 4 11:31:27 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > From: Carlos E. R. > To: Alpine-info > Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2014 13:54:25 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode ... > > (I don't use leafnode. I have stunnel listening on the loopback > > address and forwarding local connections as encrypted connections > > to one of the free News servers. But the principle is the same.) > > Curious. Usenet has been around a long time. Some of the older News clients, eg trn, knews, etc, have no encryption capabilities. Whereas most of the News servers require authentication. So I set things up like this so the authentication credentials could be transferred down an encrypted channel rather than being passed as cleartext. > >> However, I don't like how pine/alpine handles nntp, because it > >> does not keep track of what posts I read and which not. It is > >> next to useless to me this way. > >> > >> They told me to "simply delete" the posts I read, but that means > >> that I can not read them again, like email in a thread. > >> > >> That's why I now use Thunderbird a lot. :-( > > > > I also usually use a dedicated News reader. It's trn in my case. > > But there's a choice of quite a few. I quite like knews as a > > graphical interface to News. > > trn? It is not available on my distribution. So I tried to build it ... > Is it similar to slrn? The slrn program deletes posts you read, as > Pine does, and I hate that. Can't say, I've never used slrn. Trn does automatically mark artices as read. However you can stop it updating your .newsrc file to reflect these changes. Just exit with "x" rather than "q". You can also get a list of previously read articles aand reread them and/or mark them as unread. > Back to pan, knode, thunderbird... they work as expected. Yup, use whatever works for you. For me that'll be alpine & sylpheed for email. And trn, knews and alpine for Usenet. I'm sure some will disagree with my choices :-) -- Dennis Davis From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Thu Dec 4 11:52:09 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > From: Carlos E. R. > To: Alpine-info > Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2014 19:03:56 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode ... > Ha, it is not usenet, it is the opensuse.org forum. Instead of > using the http interface, I use the nntp gateway, which allows me > to read an post using a news reader. It is the only web forum I > know with this feature, and it is wonderful. Just in case you haven't seen it, you might like to have a look at: www.gmane.org The above site contains a long list of mailing lists -- including this one as gmane.mail.alpine.info -- which can be read either via the web or via a news reader using NNTP. Looks like they carry some opensuse mailing lists as well. -- Dennis Davis From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Thu Dec 4 12:06:48 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Walter Cazzola wrote: > From: Walter Cazzola > To: Dennis Davis > Cc: alpine-info@u.washington.edu > Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2014 18:29:14 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode ... > > Wild guess: > > > Alpine uses your ~/.newsrc file to track which articles you've ... > Your "wild guess" was correct! I cancelled my old .newsrc relinked That's good to hear. ... > > ...I also read News from news.aioe.org. Alpine should work > > fine connecting directly to news.aioe.org. You could consider > > cutting out the middleman -- fetchnews -- and connect directly to > > news.aioe.org. At the very least, it's just one less thing to > > potentially go wrong. > > I will give it a try. It's worth doing, just see how well it works. Works fine for what I want, going from here in the UK to the news.aioe.org server which I believe is in Italy. If it seems too slow for you, there's always the option of reading articles locally after pulling them using leafnode. Of course article numbers from news.aioe.org and those generated using leafnode are unlikely to agree. You'll need to use an appropriate .newsrc for each. -- Dennis Davis From damion.yates at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 13:27:32 2014 From: damion.yates at gmail.com (damion.yates@gmail.com) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > On 2014-12-04 18:52, Damion Yates wrote: > > On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > > > I always used "tin" maybe that's on your dist or compiles better. > > Yes, that one is available. I think I tried it years ago, I forgot > what I thought of it :-} > > Ok, tried tin. I know why I do not use it: it does not remember read > posts: it deletes them! Try just pressing r it's similar to zoomed marked messages in pine when you press z to unzoom. I've just successfully used tin again and I see new messages that I can read and older messages I have read. - Damion From mattack at apple.com Thu Dec 4 17:51:40 2014 From: mattack at apple.com (Matt Ackeret) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: >Ok, tried tin. I know why I do not use it: it does not remember read >posts: it deletes them! Same as Pine does, and the others. The second >time I visit a group, it is completely empty, and I can not work that >way. I need to see all posts, old and new, read or not, distinguish It *doesn't* delete them. They're still available. In trn you can have it show you the read messages too. It is just 'hiding' the read messages by default. I don't remember what you hit in trn, but there's a way to show you already read messages. I haven't had a Usenet server available for a long time (and I'd LOVE for basically all mailing lists, including our internal ones, to be Usenet groups instead, but anyway).. From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Thu Dec 4 18:28:56 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> Message-ID: <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-05 02:51, Matt Ackeret wrote: > On Thu, 4 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: >> Ok, tried tin. I know why I do not use it: it does not remember >> read posts: it deletes them! Same as Pine does, and the others. >> The second time I visit a group, it is completely empty, and I >> can not work that way. I need to see all posts, old and new, read >> or not, distinguish > > It *doesn't* delete them. They're still available. In trn you can > have it show you the read messages too. It is just 'hiding' the > read messages by default. I don't remember what you hit in trn, > but there's a way to show you already read messages. I know that they are not really deleted, but that's the name of the functionality. The client can not delete anything on the nntp server, obviously. And yes, it can be undone, but that is not the thing. In mail threads, with alpine for instance, you read an email and the "N" at the left side of its line in the list, disappears. You come back next day and those mails you read yesterday are there, without the "N", and new or unread emails have an "N". you can easily read any email, old or new. The client keeps track, by writing "something" in the mail folder, of what emails you read, which you answer, which you mark important, and more. But Alpine, and all the text mode nntp readers I have tried, don't do the same with nntp posts - and yes, I know the technical reasons. As it can not mark them "read", instead it "marks" them deleted. You may be used to this, but it is horrible. Thunderbird, pan, knode... keep track of every nntp post read or answered, so it is doable. With drawbacks, of course. > I haven't had a Usenet server available for a long time (and I'd > LOVE for basically all mailing lists, including our internal ones, > to be Usenet groups instead, but anyway).. True. It would make more sense. There is gmane, though ;-) - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlSBGGYACgkQtTMYHG2NR9X2YwCgkLyts8oOD+AmIYspRoBSHmvX wb8An34D56PSuiqxeuTeF4QYKZ9UnNOv =4qFn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From vjl at cullasaja.com Thu Dec 4 18:51:07 2014 From: vjl at cullasaja.com (Vince LaMonica) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Dec 4, 2014, at 9:28 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote: > In mail threads, with alpine for instance, you read an email and the > "N" at the left side of its line in the list, disappears. You come > back next day and those mails you read yesterday are there, without > the "N", and new or unread emails have an "N". you can easily read any > email, old or new. The client keeps track, by writing "something" in > the mail folder, of what emails you read, which you answer, which you > mark important, and more. Have you tried "News-Approximates-New-Status? in the settings? The HELP for this feature states: This feature causes certain messages to be marked as "New" in the MESSAGE INDEX of newsgroups. When opening a newsgroup, Pine will consult your "newsrc" file and determine the last message you have previously disposed of via the "D" key. If this feature is set, any subsequent messages will be shown in the Index with an "N", and the first of these messages will be highlighted. Although this is only an approximation of true "New" or "unseen" status, it provides a useful cue to distinguish more-or-less recent messages from those you have seen previously, but are not yet ready to mark deleted. Background: your "newsrc" file (used to store message status information for newsgroups) is only capable of storing a single flag, and Pine uses this to record whether or not you are "done with" a message, as indicated by marking the message as "Deleted". Unfortunately, this means that Pine has no way to record exactly which messages you have previously seen, so it normally does not show the "N" status flag for any messages in a newsgroup. This feature enables a starting *approximation* of seen/unseen status that may be useful. ????????? It?s been a while since I used Pine to read USENET [and i have never used Alpine to do so], but never used the ?d? key when reading messages. I would just read them, and that would unmark the ?N? from them. The messages would always appear there, and when I visit a group again, I would simply tab to the first N [unread] message, and go from there, sorting by thread. /vjl/ [for once, not using a text-based e.mail program to compose this] From chappa at gmx.com Thu Dec 4 18:55:11 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > In mail threads, with alpine for instance, you read an email and the "N" > at the left side of its line in the list, disappears. [...] > > But Alpine, and all the text mode nntp readers I have tried, don't do > the same with nntp posts - and yes, I know the technical reasons. As it > can not mark them "read", instead it "marks" them deleted. You may be > used to this, but it is horrible. > > Thunderbird, pan, knode... keep track of every nntp post read or > answered, so it is doable. With drawbacks, of course. I imagine that the reason why Thunderbird and other readers behave in a more reasonable way is because they add something to the support for news that is lacking from the protocol itself. For example, they might download the message to a local folder and save it for local reading; or they might keep a local index of messages that you have read. Whichever be true, it is not part of the protocol, so Alpine can not do much with it. Having said this, I use a maildrop to read articles, this way the "N" disappears after a message is read, I keep track of answered messages and posts never expire, so I read news as if they really were e-mail messages. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Thu Dec 4 19:33:11 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> Message-ID: <54812777.6020905@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-05 03:55, Eduardo Chappa wrote: > On Fri, 5 Dec 2014, Carlos E. R. wrote: > >> In mail threads, with alpine for instance, you read an email and the >> "N" at the left side of its line in the list, disappears. [...] >> >> But Alpine, and all the text mode nntp readers I have tried, don't do >> the same with nntp posts - and yes, I know the technical reasons. As >> it can not mark them "read", instead it "marks" them deleted. You may >> be used to this, but it is horrible. >> >> Thunderbird, pan, knode... keep track of every nntp post read or >> answered, so it is doable. With drawbacks, of course. > > I imagine that the reason why Thunderbird and other readers behave in a > more reasonable way is because they add something to the support for > news that is lacking from the protocol itself. For example, they might > download the message to a local folder and save it for local reading; or > they might keep a local index of messages that you have read. Whichever > be true, it is not part of the protocol, so Alpine can not do much with it. Yes, they keep a local index. The local cache is optional (fortunately, and it makes no sense when I have a local leafnode server). Thunderbird index format is not apparent from looking at it, but "pan" documents the format of the "groups" files in a header: # # This file has three sections. # # A. A shorthand table for the most frequent groups in the xrefs. # The first line tells the number of elements to follow, # then one line per entry with a one-character shorthand and full name. # # B. A shorthand table for the most freqent author names. # This is formatted just like the other shorthand table. # (sorted by post count, so it's also a most-frequent-posters list...) # # C. The group's headers section. # The first line tells the number of articles to follow, # then articles which each have the following lines: # 1. message-id # 2. subject # 3. author # 4. references. This line is omitted if the Article has an empty References header. # 5. time-posted. This is a time_t (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_time) # 6. xref line, server1:group1:number1 server2:group2:number2 ... # 7. has-attachments [parts-total-count parts-found-count] line-count # If has-attachments isn't 't' (for true), fields 2 and 3 are omitted. # If fields 2 and 3 are equal, the article is `complete'. # 8. One line per parts-found-count: part-index message-id byte-count You see, the "message-id" and the "xref" are sufficient to retrieve again the same message from the server, I think. They make do with a text file per group. > Having said this, I use a maildrop to read articles, this way the "N" > disappears after a message is read, I keep track of answered messages > and posts never expire, so I read news as if they really were e-mail > messages. I need to keep track of what I read, there are too many. A thread my have, say, a post per hour. If I watch the thread and read it today, tomorrow I want to read the new posts on the thread and skip those I read already. Sometimes a comment they say requires me to go back and re-read something I read yesterday, or a month ago, perhaps on a post I marked as important. This I can not do with nntp with alpine, nor any other "classical" reader. Only the graphical tools have these capabilities. Yes, I know why it is not done. But from the user point of view, it is a pity. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlSBJ3YACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UjLQCeMGucFxRLUi3MSa0cKIOxHNeP LC8AniGlfESjEKRQXFmZ/o1xyUbrVDvT =jmbL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From carlos.e.r at opensuse.org Thu Dec 4 19:42:22 2014 From: carlos.e.r at opensuse.org (Carlos E. R.) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] alpine and leafnode In-Reply-To: References: <547FC891.1040304@opensuse.org> <54806791.6010103@opensuse.org> <5480B01C.7090502@opensuse.org> <54811868.50106@opensuse.org> Message-ID: <5481299E.4000909@opensuse.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2014-12-05 03:51, Vince LaMonica wrote: > On Dec 4, 2014, at 9:28 PM, Carlos E. R. > wrote: > Have you tried "News-Approximates-New-Status? in the settings? The > HELP for this feature states: > > This feature causes certain messages to be marked as "New" in the > MESSAGE INDEX of newsgroups. Yes, it is more or less a "lastread" mark. Yes, but as the help says, it is an approximation. It is of little use when you read some threads only of a group, not the entire group. Don't worry, I'm only grumbling a bit. My problem is solved with Thunderbird, pan, knode... I just grumble that alpine and the others can't do the same, and changing this would be a very large effort, probably not worth it. So I just grumble. Forget it :-) - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlSBKZsACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UqtgCeMuk5a0G68mbdVChkh79N8aiv rzAAnjldejqiFLw7AZGVcrcmPFa7zGxV =48j+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From dsewell at virginia.edu Sat Dec 6 12:43:40 2014 From: dsewell at virginia.edu (David Sewell) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? Message-ID: I can't remember if this has ever come up as a feature request for Alpine, but would others agree that it would be useful for alpine to do a screen-clear before exiting? Otherwise, one's index headers remain visible, and that is a privacy concern to some extent. Of course it's easy to write an alias or function that invokes alpine and then "clear" or equivalent, but I've wondered why it is not built in. David S. From ghe at sdf.org Sun Dec 7 09:27:26 2014 From: ghe at sdf.org (Gregory Heytings) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi David, Could you explain what configuration you use? In my case, (Al)pine does clear the screen on exit. I have set TERM=xterm, and I have, after exiting from (Al)pine: $ alpine Alpine finished -- Closed empty folder "INBOX" $ As far as I recall, this is the behavior that I've always seen in (Al)pine, in the last ten years or so. Best, Gregory > > I can't remember if this has ever come up as a feature request for > Alpine, but would others agree that it would be useful for alpine to do > a screen-clear before exiting? Otherwise, one's index headers remain > visible, and that is a privacy concern to some extent. > > Of course it's easy to write an alias or function that invokes alpine > and then "clear" or equivalent, but I've wondered why it is not built > in. > > David S. > From dsewell at virginia.edu Sun Dec 7 10:06:24 2014 From: dsewell at virginia.edu (David Sewell) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Aha. You're right, this was a quirk of my configuration. Since forever, I've been setting TERM=nsterm-16color in OS X. (At some point in the past, that was the best one to use.) With that term setting, no screen clearing happens. With the current default OS X setting of TERM=xterm-color, it does. So not an Alpine issue but interaction with system terminal settings. Thanks for the pointer! On Sun, 7 Dec 2014, Gregory Heytings wrote: > > Hi David, > > Could you explain what configuration you use? In my case, (Al)pine does > clear the screen on exit. I have set TERM=xterm, and I have, after exiting > from (Al)pine: > > > $ alpine > Alpine finished -- Closed empty folder "INBOX" > $ > > As far as I recall, this is the behavior that I've always seen in (Al)pine, > in the last ten years or so. > > Best, > > Gregory > >> >> I can't remember if this has ever come up as a feature request for Alpine, >> but would others agree that it would be useful for alpine to do a >> screen-clear before exiting? Otherwise, one's index headers remain visible, >> and that is a privacy concern to some extent. >> >> Of course it's easy to write an alias or function that invokes alpine and >> then "clear" or equivalent, but I've wondered why it is not built in. >> >> David S. >> > -- David Sewell, Editorial and Technical Manager ROTUNDA, The University of Virginia Press PO Box 400314, Charlottesville, VA 22904-4314 USA Email: dsewell@virginia.edu Tel: +1 434 924 9973 Web: http://rotunda.upress.virginia.edu/ From chappa at gmx.com Sun Dec 7 10:24:39 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 6 Dec 2014, David Sewell wrote: > I can't remember if this has ever come up as a feature request for > Alpine, but would others agree that it would be useful for alpine to do > a screen-clear before exiting? Otherwise, one's index headers remain > visible, and that is a privacy concern to some extent. I have noticed a difference in the behavior of Alpine upon exiting when Alpine is compiled with curses or ncurses. In the case of the former, you find the behavior you describe, and in the latter case the screen is cleared upon exiting. So if you can compile with ncurses, then Alpine will behave in the way you want it to do. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From jose1711 at gmail.com Mon Dec 8 00:59:45 2014 From: jose1711 at gmail.com (Jose Riha) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] server-side search for gmail Message-ID: hello list, does anyone knows if it is possible to do a serverside search in configured gmail account? it is quite common that i need to go further back than my current imap limit of 1000 synced messages. is such thing planned for the future or anyone knows of a workaround (other than reaching for my smartphone or logging via webbrowser)? thank you, jose From chappa at gmx.com Mon Dec 8 08:29:35 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] server-side search for gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Dec 2014, Jose Riha wrote: > does anyone knows if it is possible to do a serverside search in > configured gmail account? it is quite common that i need to go further > back than my current imap limit of 1000 synced messages. is such thing > planned for the future or anyone knows of a workaround (other than > reaching for my smartphone or logging via webbrowser)? You can only do a search on the messages that are available in the server, so that means that if the IMAP server does not have certain messages loaded, then that server will never find anything in the missing messages. Think of the IMAP server and the web interface as two different interfaces. One led to the other, but it is not equivalent to the other, so that means that the web interface is the only place where you will be able to find everything you want. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From jose1711 at gmail.com Mon Dec 8 08:32:13 2014 From: jose1711 at gmail.com (Jozef Riha) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] server-side search for gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: hello eduardo, i get it. but still.. is there any chance of seeing this "extra" feature in alpine implemented outside of imap4 support? thank you, jose On Mon, Dec 8, 2014 at 5:29 PM, Eduardo Chappa wrote: > On Mon, 8 Dec 2014, Jose Riha wrote: > > does anyone knows if it is possible to do a serverside search in >> configured gmail account? it is quite common that i need to go further back >> than my current imap limit of 1000 synced messages. is such thing planned >> for the future or anyone knows of a workaround (other than reaching for my >> smartphone or logging via webbrowser)? >> > > You can only do a search on the messages that are available in the server, > so that means that if the IMAP server does not have certain messages > loaded, then that server will never find anything in the missing messages. > Think of the IMAP server and the web interface as two different > interfaces. One led to the other, but it is not equivalent to the other, so > that means that the web interface is the only place where you will be able > to find everything you want. > > -- > Eduardo > http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chappa at gmx.com Mon Dec 8 08:45:32 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] server-side search for gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Dec 2014, Jozef Riha wrote: > i get it. but still.. is there any chance of seeing this "extra" feature > in alpine implemented outside of imap4 support? One should never say never, but this one is going to take a long time, if we ever get there. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From poobah at ruptured-duck.com Mon Dec 8 13:30:31 2014 From: poobah at ruptured-duck.com (Bob Bernstein) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] server-side search for gmail In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Dec 2014, Jose Riha wrote: > does anyone knows if it is possible to do a > serverside search in configured gmail account? it is > quite common that i need to go further back than my > current imap limit of 1000 synced messages. Try: 1. fetchmail and: 2. mairix Problem solved! -- "Natasha! First we shoot jet, then we go after moose and squirrel." From lucio at lambrate.inaf.it Tue Dec 9 01:19:13 2014 From: lucio at lambrate.inaf.it (Lucio Chiappetti) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 6 Dec 2014, David Sewell wrote: > Of course it's easy to write an alias or function that invokes alpine > and then "clear" or equivalent, but I've wondered why it is not built > in. Actually I guess everybody here invokes alpine with an alias that runs alpine in its own terminal window (most people use a common provided script, some like me use their own customized ... that's for Linux users, Windows users with PCPine have equivalent arrangements), so the entire windows will disappear when one exits alpine -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Bassini 15 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Do not like Firefox >=29 ? Get Pale Moon ! http://www.palemoon.org From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Tue Dec 9 02:19:46 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Dec 2014, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: > From: Lucio Chiappetti > To: Alpine List > Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 09:19:13 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? > > On Sat, 6 Dec 2014, David Sewell wrote: > > > Of course it's easy to write an alias or function that invokes > > alpine and then "clear" or equivalent, but I've wondered why it > > is not built in. > > Actually I guess everybody here invokes alpine with an alias that > runs alpine in its own terminal window (most people use a common > provided script, some like me use their own customized ... that's > for Linux users, Windows users ^^^^^ Linux ?? What's that ??? Let's not be so parochial. There's more to the Unix world than just Linux. For example, the OP was using an Apple running OSX. I'm running OpenBSD. Alpine runs on most Unix variants. I've a small wish (Tk) script that creates a simple button bar to fire up applications. It's sticky, and I leave it at the top of the screen. It fires up alpine in a rxvt-unicode terminal window. I'm an antique, so I also fire up alpine" the old-fashioned way, ie by *actually* typing "alpine" in a terminal window :-) -- Dennis Davis From poobah at ruptured-duck.com Tue Dec 9 15:05:05 2014 From: poobah at ruptured-duck.com (Bob Bernstein) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Dec 2014, Dennis Davis wrote: > Linux ?? What's that ??? Now, now, we don't want any religious wars started here! > ...the OP was using an Apple running OSX. Some things just can't be helped. > I'm running OpenBSD. NetBSD here! > I've a small wish (Tk) script that creates a simple > button bar to fire up applications. d00D! Way kewl. > I'm an antique, so I also fire up alpine" the > old-fashioned way, ie by *actually* typing "alpine" > in a terminal window :-) Me too! Me too! -- "Natasha! First we shoot jet, then we go after moose and squirrel." From mattack at apple.com Tue Dec 9 15:21:37 2014 From: mattack at apple.com (Matt Ackeret) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Dec 2014, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: > Actually I guess everybody here invokes alpine with an alias that runs alpine > in its own terminal window (most people use a common provided script, some > like me use their own customized ... that's for Linux users, Windows users > with PCPine have equivalent arrangements), so the entire windows will > disappear when one exits alpine I definitely don't do that.. My Terminal window 3 is virtually always my alpine window. So I hit cmd-3 to get to alpine. (I used to have something else I defaulted to in window 1.. window 2 is my really wide black background window, to deal with stuff that needs wider lines than 80.. though I resize windows back and forth a lot nowadays when I used to not.... Though I think once in a rare while I've had alpine crash if I resize it at the wrong point..) From lucio at lambrate.inaf.it Wed Dec 10 01:24:25 2014 From: lucio at lambrate.inaf.it (Lucio Chiappetti) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Clear screen option on exit? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Dec 2014, Dennis Davis wrote: > On Tue, 9 Dec 2014, Lucio Chiappetti wrote: >> Actually I guess everybody here invokes alpine with an alias that >> runs alpine in its own terminal window (most people [...] that's >> for Linux users, Windows users ... > ^^^^^ I forgot to say that by "here" I meant "my institute" (not the alpine mailing list) > Linux ?? What's that ??? > > Let's not be so parochial. There's more to the Unix world than just > Linux. [...] Alpine runs on most Unix variants. You should have forgotten a smiley :-) Well, actually I have been a keen pine/alpine user back from the time of SunOS, then Solaris, then Ultrix, then Tru64 Unix. It's a pity that the h/w supporting those has become too expensive vs cheaper alternatives supporting Linux. End OT -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Lucio Chiappetti - INAF/IASF - via Bassini 15 - I-20133 Milano (Italy) For more info : http://www.iasf-milano.inaf.it/~lucio/personal.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Do not like Firefox >=29 ? Get Pale Moon ! http://www.palemoon.org From kkblore at gmail.com Fri Dec 12 09:05:27 2014 From: kkblore at gmail.com (Karthik Vishwanath) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] deleting messages Message-ID: Hello, I use alpine for reading mail from a gmail account. There are 2 issues I am having: 1. When I "delete" and then "expunge" a message in my INBOX, it is gone from my INBOX but is still available under "[Gmail]/All Mail". Is there way for me to make alpine move these messages to the "[Gmail/Trash" folder, instead? 2. The second issue regards when messages marked "D" are actually expunged. Previously, I had to use "X" for expunging them. Although I have the option "Expunge Only Manually" selected, messages from INBOX are expunged on other operations (such as saving other messages, or pressing the down-arrow on the last message etc). How to change this behavior? Thanks, -- -Karthik Vishwanath -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chappa at gmx.com Fri Dec 12 10:42:24 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] deleting messages In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Dec 2014, Karthik Vishwanath wrote: > 1. When I "delete" and then "expunge" a message in my INBOX, it is gone > from my INBOX but is still available under "[Gmail]/All Mail". Is there > way for me to make alpine move these messages to the "[Gmail/Trash" > folder, instead? Dear Karthik, The messages are available in the All Mail folder, because Gmail adds them there. Alpine does not do this. You can however, create a filter that will move deleted messages to any folder (press M S R F to set up a filter.) > 2. The second issue regards when messages marked "D" are actually > expunged. Previously, I had to use "X" for expunging them. Although I > have the option "Expunge Only Manually" selected, messages from INBOX > are expunged on other operations (such as saving other messages, or > pressing the down-arrow on the last message etc). How to change this > behavior? You have to log in to your Gmail account with a browser, and take a look at your IMAP settings. The behavior you are thinking of is one of the settings there. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From damion.yates at gmail.com Sat Dec 13 07:00:23 2014 From: damion.yates at gmail.com (damion.yates@gmail.com) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] deleting messages In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Dec 2014, Eduardo Chappa wrote: > On Fri, 12 Dec 2014, Karthik Vishwanath wrote: > > > 1. When I "delete" and then "expunge" a message in my INBOX, it is > > gone from my INBOX but is still available under "[Gmail]/All Mail". > > Is there way for me to make alpine move these messages to the > > "[Gmail/Trash" folder, instead? > > The messages are available in the All Mail folder, because Gmail adds > them there. Alpine does not do this. You can however, create a filter > that will move deleted messages to any folder (press M S R F to set up > a filter.) > > > 2. The second issue regards when messages marked "D" are actually > > expunged. Previously, I had to use "X" for expunging them. Although > > I have the option "Expunge Only Manually" selected, messages from > > INBOX are expunged on other operations (such as saving other > > messages, or pressing the down-arrow on the last message etc). How > > to change this behavior? > > You have to log in to your Gmail account with a browser, and take a > look at your IMAP settings. The behavior you are thinking of is one of > the settings there. Actually both are features which can be controlled via gmail's IMAP settings. You can choose to have messages you delete be actually deleted or go to Bin (if UK, Trash if USA). And as per Eduardo's comment, also turn off auto-expunge which (al)pine doesn't like much. There are a couple of other gmail issues you may encounter. Saving messages results in a the message size typically being smaller than header+body and as bonkers as it sounds, that's apparently too hard to fix. I raised a bug with the imap team about 5 years ago and last month they finally admitted defeat. Alpine doesn't complain when the message is too large, but it pauses and prompts you if too small. There is a patch floating around to disable this and I'd recommend using it. Your email couldn't possibly be safer than in gmail, the warning makes no sense in this day and age of reliable cloud hosted mail. If you read emails in the webUI as well as via imap you'll find read/delete/etc status will fail to sync properly into imap. The other way works fine. This bug only shows in specific situations as described above so I've not raised it, but it is starting to irritate me so I may try and see if this one is feasible. - Damion From klewellen at shellworld.net Sat Dec 20 20:26:53 2014 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] "Inbox closed due to access error?" Message-ID: Hi all, I think I mentioned having this problem before, but might not have shared the exact issue. It is continuing even though the provider involved has moved our server to the same one where their mail is managed, same computer area I should say. Here is what happens. I am reading mail in alpine, and find I wish to answer. While I am drafting my email though my inbox apparently closes, so that when I am finished I cannot go back to reading email. I hope this is making sense, as I have never had the problem with any other mail program. I am for example drafting this email in pine, and know my inbox will still be waiting for me once I am done. Thoughts? Karen From klewellen at shellworld.net Mon Dec 22 06:50:54 2014 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] for the alpine issue. (fwd) Message-ID: Hi, here it is. I needed to be careful as this problem is tied to a totally different address. I use pine here at shellworld and did not want to get the files confused. thanks, Karen From: karen lewellen Subject: for the alpine issue. Karen Lewellen - President/Senior Producer Curtain Up Distribution INC. Using media to champion under represented voices & ideas since 1990. -------------- next part -------------- # # Alpine configuration file # # This file sets the configuration options used by Alpine and PC-Alpine. These # options are usually set from within Alpine or PC-Alpine. There may be a # system-wide configuration file which sets the defaults for some of the # variables. On Unix, run alpine -conf to see how system defaults have been set. # For variables that accept multiple values, list elements are separated by # commas. A line beginning with a space or tab is considered to be a # continuation of the previous line. For a variable to be unset its value must # be blank. To set a variable to the empty string its value should be "". # You can override system defaults by setting a variable to the empty string. # Lines beginning with "#" are comments, and ignored by Alpine. # Over-rides your full name from Unix password file. Required for PC-Alpine. personal-name= # Sets domain part of From: and local addresses in outgoing mail. user-domain=curtainupdistribution.org # List of SMTP servers for sending mail. If blank: Unix Alpine uses sendmail. smtp-server=mail.curtainupdistribution.org/user=klewellen@curtainupdistribution.org/novalidate-cert # NNTP server for posting news. Also sets news-collections for news reading. nntp-server= # Path of (local or remote) INBOX, e.g. ={mail.somewhere.edu}inbox # Normal Unix default is the local INBOX (usually /usr/spool/mail/$USER). inbox-path={mail.curtainupdistribution.org/user=klewellen@curtainupdistribution.org/novalidate-cert}INBOX # List of folder pairs; the first indicates a folder to archive, and the # second indicates the folder read messages in the first should # be moved to. incoming-archive-folders= # List of folders, assumed to be in first folder collection, # offered for pruning each month. For example: mumble pruned-folders= # Over-rides default path for sent-mail folder, e.g. =old-mail (using first # folder collection dir) or ={host2}sent-mail or ="" (to suppress saving). # Default: sent-mail (Unix) or SENTMAIL.MTX (PC) in default folder collection. default-fcc= # Over-rides default path for saved-msg folder, e.g. =saved-messages (using 1st # folder collection dir) or ={host2}saved-mail or ="" (to suppress saving). # Default: saved-messages (Unix) or SAVEMAIL.MTX (PC) in default collection. default-saved-msg-folder= # Over-rides default path for postponed messages folder, e.g. =pm (which uses # first folder collection dir) or ={host4}pm (using home dir on host4). # Default: postponed-msgs (Unix) or POSTPOND.MTX (PC) in default fldr coltn. postponed-folder= # If set, specifies where already-read messages will be moved upon quitting. read-message-folder= # If set, specifies where form letters should be stored. form-letter-folder= # If set, specifies where trash is moved to in Web Alpine. trash-folder= # Contains the actual signature contents as opposed to the signature filename. # If defined, this overrides the signature-file. Default is undefined. literal-signature=Karen Lewellen - President/Senior Producer\nCurtain Up Distribution INC.\nUsing media to champion under represented voices & ideas since 1990.\n # Over-rides default path for signature file. Default is ~/.signature signature-file= # List of features; see Alpine's Setup/options menu for the current set. # e.g. feature-list= select-without-confirm, signature-at-bottom # Default condition for all of the features is no-. feature-list=no-enable-alternate-editor-implicitly, spell-check-before-sending, enable-reply-indent-string-editing, include-attachments-in-reply, no-enable-dot-folders, no-enable-lame-list-mode, no-separate-folder-and-directory-entries, show-cursor, show-plain-text-internally # Alpine executes these keys upon startup (e.g. to view msg 13: i,j,1,3,CR,v) initial-keystroke-list= # Only show these headers (by default) when composing messages default-composer-hdrs= # Add these customized headers (and possible default values) when composing customized-hdrs= # When viewing messages, include this list of headers viewer-hdrs= # When viewing messages, number of blank spaces between left display edge and text viewer-margin-left= # When viewing messages, number of blank spaces between right display edge and text viewer-margin-right= # When viewing messages, number of lines of quote displayed before suppressing quote-suppression-threshold= # Determines default folder name for Saves... # Choices: default-folder, by-sender, by-from, by-recipient, last-folder-used. # Default: "default-folder", i.e. "saved-messages" (Unix) or "SAVEMAIL" (PC). saved-msg-name-rule= # Determines default name for Fcc... # Choices: default-fcc, by-recipient, last-fcc-used. # Default: "default-fcc" (see also "default-fcc=" variable.) fcc-name-rule= # Sets presentation order of messages in Index. Choices: # Subject, From, Arrival, Date, Size, To, Cc, OrderedSubj, Score, and Thread. # Order may be reversed by appending /Reverse. Default: "Arrival". sort-key= # Sets presentation order of address book entries. Choices: dont-sort, # fullname-with-lists-last, fullname, nickname-with-lists-last, nickname # Default: "fullname-with-lists-last". addrbook-sort-rule= # Sets presentation order of folder list entries. Choices: alphabetical, # alpha-with-dirs-last, alpha-with-dirs-first. # Default: "alpha-with-directories-last". folder-sort-rule= # Sets the default folder and collection offered at the Goto Command's prompt. goto-default-rule= # Sets message which cursor begins on. Choices: first-unseen, first-recent, # first-important, first-important-or-unseen, first-important-or-recent, # first, last. Default: "first-unseen". incoming-startup-rule= # Allows a default answer for the prune folder questions. Choices: yes-ask, # yes-no, no-ask, no-no, ask-ask, ask-no. Default: "ask-ask". pruning-rule= # Controls behavior when reopening an already open folder. folder-reopen-rule= # Style that MESSAGE INDEX is displayed in when threading. threading-display-style= # Style of THREAD INDEX or default MESSAGE INDEX when threading. threading-index-style= # When threading, character used to indicate collapsed messages underneath. threading-indicator-character= # When threading, character used to indicate expanded messages underneath. threading-expanded-character= # When threading, character used to indicate this is the last reply # to the parent of this message. threading-lastreply-character= # Reflects capabilities of the display you have. # If unset, the default is taken from your locale. That is usually the right # thing to use. Typical alternatives include UTF-8, ISO-8859-x, and EUC-JP # (where x is a number between 1 and 9). display-character-set= # Reflects capabilities of the keyboard you have. # If unset, the default is to use the same value # used for the display-character-set. keyboard-character-set= # Defaults to UTF-8. This is used for outgoing messages. # It is usually correct to leave this unset. posting-character-set= # Defaults to nothing, which is equivalent to US-ASCII. This is used for # unlabeled incoming messages. It is ok to leave this unset but if you receive # unlabeled mail that is usually in some known character set, set that here. unknown-character-set= # Specifies the program invoked by ^_ in the Composer, # or the "enable-alternate-editor-implicitly" feature. editor= # Specifies the program invoked by ^T in the Composer. speller= # Specifies the column of the screen where the composer should wrap. composer-wrap-column= # Specifies the string to insert when replying to a message. reply-indent-string= # Specifies the introduction to insert when replying to a message. reply-leadin= # Specifies the string to replace quotes with when viewing a message. quote-replace-string= # When these characters appear in the middle of a word in the composer # the forward word function will stop at the first text following (as happens # with SPACE characters by default) composer-word-separators= # Specifies the string to use when sending a message with no to or cc. empty-header-message= # Program to view images (e.g. GIF or TIFF attachments). image-viewer= # If "user-domain" not set, strips hostname in FROM address. (Unix only) use-only-domain-name= # This variable takes a list of programs that message text is piped into # after MIME decoding, prior to display. display-filters= # This defines a program that message text is piped into before MIME # encoding, prior to sending sending-filters= # A list of alternate addresses the user is known by alt-addresses= # A list of keywords for use in categorizing messages keywords= # Characters which surround keywords in SUBJKEY token. # Default is "{" "} " keyword-surrounding-chars= # Characters between subject and opening text in SUBJECTTEXT token. # Default is " - " opening-text-separator-chars= # This is a list of formats for address books. Each entry in the list is made # up of space-delimited tokens telling which fields are displayed and in # which order. See help text addressbook-formats= # This gives a format for displaying the index. It is made # up of space-delimited tokens telling which fields are displayed and in # which order. See help text index-format= # The number of lines of overlap when scrolling through message text viewer-overlap= # Number of lines from top and bottom of screen where single # line scrolling occurs. scroll-margin= # The number of seconds to sleep after writing a status message status-message-delay= # Number of times per-second to update busy cue messages busy-cue-rate= # The approximate number of seconds between checks for new mail mail-check-interval=15 # The approximate number of seconds between checks for new mail in folders # other than the current folder and inbox. # Default is same as mail-check-interval mail-check-interval-noncurrent= # The minimum number of seconds between checks for new mail in a Mail Drop. # This is always effectively at least as large as the mail-check-interval maildrop-check-minimum= # For newsgroups accessed using NNTP, only messages numbered in the range # lastmsg-range+1 to lastmsg will be considered nntp-range= # Full path and name of NEWSRC file newsrc-path= # Path and filename of news configuration's active file. # The default is typically "/usr/lib/news/active". news-active-file-path= # Directory containing system's news data. # The default is typically "/usr/spool/news" news-spool-directory= # Path and filename of the program used to upload text from your terminal # emulator's into Alpine's composer. upload-command= # Text sent to terminal emulator prior to invoking the program defined by # the upload-command variable. # Note: _FILE_ will be replaced with the temporary file used in the upload. upload-command-prefix= # Path and filename of the program used to download text via your terminal # emulator from Alpine's export and save commands. download-command= # Text sent to terminal emulator prior to invoking the program defined by # the download-command variable. # Note: _FILE_ will be replaced with the temporary file used in the download. download-command-prefix= # Sets the search path for the mailcap configuration file. # NOTE: colon delimited under UNIX, semi-colon delimited under DOS/Windows/OS2. mailcap-search-path= # Sets the search path for the mimetypes configuration file. # NOTE: colon delimited under UNIX, semi-colon delimited under DOS/Windows/OS2. mimetype-search-path= # List of programs to open Internet URLs (e.g. http or ftp references). url-viewers= # The maximum number of non-stayopen remote connections that Alpine will use max-remote-connections= # A list of folders that should be left open once opened (INBOX is implicit) stay-open-folders= # Sets the time in seconds that Alpine will attempt to open a network # connection when checking for new unseen messages in an incoming folder. # The default is 5. incoming-check-timeout= # Sets the approximate number of seconds between checks for unseen messages # in incoming folders. The default is 180. incoming-check-interval= # Sets the approximate number of seconds between checks for unseen messages # for other than local or IMAP folders. The default is 180. incoming-check-interval-secondary= # List of incoming folders to check for unseen messages. The default if left # blank is to check all incoming folders. incoming-check-list= # Specifies the number of dead letter files to keep when canceling. dead-letter-files= # Sets the filename for the newmail fifo (named pipe). Unix only. newmail-fifo-path= # Sets the width for the NewMail screen. newmail-window-width= # List of incoming msg folders besides INBOX, e.g. ={host2}inbox, {host3}inbox # Syntax: optnl-label {optnl-imap-host-name}folder-path incoming-folders= # List of directories where saved-message folders may be. First one is # the default for Saves. Example: Main {host1}mail/[], Desktop mail\[] # Syntax: optnl-label {optnl-imap-hostname}optnl-directory-path[] folder-collections=mail/[], IMAP {mail.curtainupdistribution.org/user=klewellen@curtainupdistribution.org/novalidate-cert}INBOX.[] # List, only needed if nntp-server not set, or news is on a different host # than used for NNTP posting. Examples: News *[] or News *{host3/nntp}[] # Syntax: optnl-label *{news-host/protocol}[] news-collections= # List of file or path names for personal addressbook(s). # Default: ~/.addressbook (Unix) or \PINE\ADDRBOOK (PC) # Syntax: optnl-label path-name address-book= # List of file or path names for global/shared addressbook(s). # Default: none # Syntax: optnl-label path-name global-address-book= # Set by Alpine; controls beginning-of-month sent-mail pruning. last-time-prune-questioned=114.12 # Set by Alpine; controls display of "new version" message. last-version-used=6.02 # This names the path to an alternative program, and any necessary arguments, # to be used in posting mail messages. Example: # /usr/lib/sendmail -oem -t -oi # or, # /usr/local/bin/sendit.sh # The latter a script found in Alpine distribution's contrib/util directory. # NOTE: The program MUST read the message to be posted on standard input, # AND operate in the style of sendmail's "-t" option. sendmail-path= # This names the root of the tree to which the user is restricted when reading # and writing folders and files. For example, on Unix ~/work confines the # user to the subtree beginning with their work subdirectory. # (Note: this alone is not sufficient for preventing access. You will also # need to restrict shell access and so on, see Alpine Technical Notes.) # Default: not set (so no restriction) operating-dir= # If no user input for this many hours, Alpine will exit if in an idle loop # waiting for a new command. If set to zero (the default), then there will # be no timeout. user-input-timeout= # Sets the time in seconds that Alpine will attempt to open a network # connection. The default is 30, the minimum is 5, and the maximum is # system defined (typically 75). tcp-open-timeout= # Network read warning timeout. The default is 15, the minimum is 5, and the # maximum is 1000. tcp-read-warning-timeout= # Network write warning timeout. The default is 0 (unset), the minimum # is 5 (if not 0), and the maximum is 1000. tcp-write-warning-timeout= # If this much time has elapsed at the time of a tcp read or write # timeout, Alpine will ask if you want to break the connection. # Default is 60 seconds, minimum is 5, maximum is 1000. tcp-query-timeout= # Sets the format of the command used to open a UNIX remote # shell connection. The default is "%s %s -l %s exec /etc/r%sd" # NOTE: the 4 (four) "%s" entries MUST exist in the provided command # where the first is for the command's path, the second is for the # host to connect to, the third is for the user to connect as, and the # fourth is for the connection method (typically "imap") rsh-command= # Sets the name of the command used to open a UNIX remote shell connection. # The default is typically /usr/ucb/rsh. rsh-path= # Sets the time in seconds that Alpine will attempt to open a UNIX remote # shell connection. The default is 15, min is 5, and max is unlimited. # Zero disables rsh altogether. rsh-open-timeout= # Sets the format of the command used to open a UNIX secure # shell connection. The default is "%s %s -l %s exec /etc/r%sd" # NOTE: the 4 (four) "%s" entries MUST exist in the provided command # where the first is for the command's path, the second is for the # host to connect to, the third is for the user to connect as, and the # fourth is for the connection method (typically "imap") ssh-command= # Sets the name of the command used to open a UNIX secure shell connection. # Typically this is /usr/bin/ssh. ssh-path= # Sets the time in seconds that Alpine will attempt to open a UNIX secure # shell connection. The default is 15, min is 5, and max is unlimited. # Zero disables ssh altogether. ssh-open-timeout= # Sets the version number Alpine will use as a threshold for offering # its new version message on startup. new-version-threshold= # List of mail drivers to disable. disable-these-drivers= # List of SASL authenticators to disable. disable-these-authenticators= # Set by Alpine; contains data for caching remote address books. remote-abook-metafile= # How many extra copies of remote address book should be kept. Default: 3 remote-abook-history= # Minimum number of minutes between checks for remote address book changes. # 0 means never check except when opening a remote address book. # -1 means never check. Default: 5 remote-abook-validity= # Your default printer selection printer= # List of special print commands personal-print-command= # Which category default print command is in personal-print-category= # Patterns and their actions are stored here. patterns-roles= # Patterns and their actions are stored here. patterns-filters2= # Patterns and their actions are stored here. patterns-scores2= # Patterns and their actions are stored here. patterns-indexcolors= # Patterns and their actions are stored here. patterns-other= # Patterns and their actions are stored here. patterns-search= # Controls display of color color-style= # Controls display of color for current index line current-indexline-style= # Controls display of color for the titlebar at top of screen titlebar-color-style= # Choose: black, blue, green, cyan, red, magenta, yellow, or white. normal-foreground-color= normal-background-color= reverse-foreground-color= reverse-background-color= title-foreground-color= title-background-color= title-closed-foreground-color= title-closed-background-color= status-foreground-color= status-background-color= keylabel-foreground-color= keylabel-background-color= keyname-foreground-color= keyname-background-color= selectable-item-foreground-color= selectable-item-background-color= meta-message-foreground-color= meta-message-background-color= quote1-foreground-color= quote1-background-color= quote2-foreground-color= quote2-background-color= quote3-foreground-color= quote3-background-color= incoming-unseen-foreground-color= incoming-unseen-background-color= signature-foreground-color= signature-background-color= prompt-foreground-color= prompt-background-color= header-general-foreground-color= header-general-background-color= index-to-me-foreground-color= index-to-me-background-color= index-important-foreground-color= index-important-background-color= index-deleted-foreground-color= index-deleted-background-color= index-answered-foreground-color= index-answered-background-color= index-new-foreground-color= index-new-background-color= index-recent-foreground-color= index-recent-background-color= index-forward-foreground-color= index-forward-background-color= index-unseen-foreground-color= index-unseen-background-color= index-highpriority-foreground-color= index-highpriority-background-color= index-lowpriority-foreground-color= index-lowpriority-background-color= index-arrow-foreground-color= index-arrow-background-color= index-subject-foreground-color= index-subject-background-color= index-from-foreground-color= index-from-background-color= index-opening-foreground-color= index-opening-background-color= # When viewing messages, these are the header colors viewer-hdr-colors= # Colors used to display keywords in the index keyword-colors= # Public certificates are kept in files in this directory. The files should # contain certificates in PEM format. The name of each file should look # like .crt. The default directory is .alpine-smime/public. smime-public-cert-directory= # If this option is set then public certificates are kept in a single container # "file" similar to a remote configuration file instead of in the # smime-publiccert-directory. The value can be a remote or local folder # specification like for a non-standard pinerc value. The default # is that it is not set. smime-public-cert-container= # Private keys are kept in files in this directory. The files are in PEM format. # The name of a file should look like .key. # The default directory is .alpine-smime/private. smime-private-key-directory= # If this option is set then private keys are kept in a single container # "file" similar to a remote configuration file instead of in the # private-key-directory. The value can be a remote or local folder # specification like for a non-standard pinerc value. The default # is that it is not set. smime-private-key-container= # Certificate Authority certificates (in addition to the normal CACerts for the # system) are kept in files in this directory. The files are in PEM format. # Filenames should end with .crt. The default directory is .alpine-smime/ca. smime-cacert-directory= # If this option is set then CAcerts are kept in a single container # "file" similar to a remote configuration file instead of in the # ca-cert-directory. The value can be a remote or local folder # specification like for a non-standard pinerc value. The default # is that it is not set. smime-cacert-container= # LDAP servers for looking up addresses. ldap-servers= # RSS News feed rss-news= # RSS Weather feed rss-weather= # Web Alpine index table row height wp-indexheight= # Web Alpine number of index lines in table wp-indexlines= # Web Alpine aggregate operations tab state wp-aggstate= # Web Alpine various aspects of cross-session state wp-state= # Web Alpine preferred width for message display in characters wp-columns= From klewellen at shellworld.net Tue Dec 23 10:57:29 2014 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, Here is the timestamped latest file. I did not visit any links this time, simply read and wrote emails. there is a line at the end saying my mail was turned off? As expressed, the firefox idea is useless. First it has nothing to do with the time out issue, and second dreamhost does not provide this browser on the shell aspect of their service. that is where I am using alpine, and I understand firefox cannot be configured on shell services. Anyway, thoughts on the latest example. Karen -------------- next part -------------- 10:30:26.097880: 10:30:26.098078: "alpine" "-d" "9" "-d" "timestamp" (PID=28544) 10:30:26.196769: Opening "INBOX" 10:31:12.675604: Opening "INBOX" DONE [not actually shown] 10:31:12.675644: Folder "INBOX" opened with 52 messages - 1 new 10:31:25.223305: Command "SPACE" not defined for this screen. Use ? for help 10:42:26.689744: Writing Fcc DONE [not actually shown] 10:42:26.689780: Updating "Answered" Flags 10:42:26.691819: Updating "Answered" Flags DONE [not actually shown] 10:42:26.691839: Message sent and copied to "sent-mail". [not actually shown] 10:42:26.691896: MAIL FOLDER "INBOX" CLOSED DUE TO ACCESS ERROR 10:42:49.848384: Turning off new messages while reviewing From bcasavan at angeltread.org Tue Dec 23 11:11:46 2014 From: bcasavan at angeltread.org (Brent Casavant) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> For what it's worth I've had this same problem ever since my hosting provider (dreamhost.com) implemented a load balancer in front of their IMAP servers over a year ago. It effectively made alpine unusable for me. As a result I've finally given in and (usually) use Thunderbird these days, which is my work-around until such time as I get off my lazy duff and migrate to another hosting provider. Within Alpine the best method I've found to deal with the situation is to go to the folder list and then re-select the INBOX. Annoying, but it works. I'm not sure why this affects Alpine but apparently not other email clients -- or at least the few I've tried. I know that's not of much help, but maybe it helps to know you're not alone in this frustration? Thanks, Brent On 12/23/2014 12:57 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote: > Hi, > Here is the timestamped latest file. I did not visit any links this > time, simply read and wrote emails. > there is a line at the end saying my mail was turned off? > As expressed, the firefox idea is useless. First it has nothing to do > with the time out issue, and second dreamhost does not provide this > browser on the shell aspect of their service. that is where I am using > alpine, and I understand firefox cannot be configured on shell services. > Anyway, thoughts on the latest example. > Karen > > > > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > -- Brent Casavant bcasavan@angeltread.org From klewellen at shellworld.net Tue Dec 23 11:25:10 2014 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> Message-ID: Brent, You are a prince. Dreamhost is stumped by the problem as well. I understand that alpine is the only mail client they provide on their servers, ours is hosting plan for our media nonprofit organization...so we cannot just change clients. I am so happy to know it is not just me though! Hopefully someone here can give me enough firm information to share with dreamhost. They are now using ubintu and actually moved our account on to the server where mail and alpine reside in an effort to fix the problem. That folder to restart the inbox may be afine last resort. Thanks for providing a bit of peace for me on this. Kare On Tue, 23 Dec 2014, Brent Casavant wrote: > For what it's worth I've had this same problem ever since my hosting > provider (dreamhost.com) implemented a load balancer in front of > their IMAP servers over a year ago. It effectively made alpine unusable > for me. As a result I've finally given in and (usually) use Thunderbird > these days, which is my work-around until such time as I get off my lazy > duff and migrate to another hosting provider. > > Within Alpine the best method I've found to deal with the situation > is to go to the folder list and then re-select the INBOX. Annoying, > but it works. > > I'm not sure why this affects Alpine but apparently not other email > clients -- or at least the few I've tried. > > I know that's not of much help, but maybe it helps to know you're not > alone in this frustration? > > Thanks, > Brent > > On 12/23/2014 12:57 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote: >> Hi, >> Here is the timestamped latest file. I did not visit any links this >> time, simply read and wrote emails. >> there is a line at the end saying my mail was turned off? >> As expressed, the firefox idea is useless. First it has nothing to do >> with the time out issue, and second dreamhost does not provide this >> browser on the shell aspect of their service. that is where I am using >> alpine, and I understand firefox cannot be configured on shell services. >> Anyway, thoughts on the latest example. >> Karen >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alpine-info mailing list >> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> > > -- > Brent Casavant > bcasavan@angeltread.org > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > > > From chappa at gmx.com Tue Dec 23 11:31:38 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> Message-ID: Dear Karen, If you have your account in the server, try pressing M S C and delete the value of inbox-path, then quit and restart Alpine. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From bcasavan at angeltread.org Tue Dec 23 11:41:01 2014 From: bcasavan at angeltread.org (Brent Casavant) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> Message-ID: <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> If Dreamhost is really interested in solving this problem, I'd be more than happy to be a test dummy for them. Feel free to pass along my name to them, and let them know it started happening when they implemented load balancers on their mail systems. For me this begin toward mid-to-late February of 2014. I communicated with their support staff about this issue on March 3, receiving a response on March 5, where they detailed what they were doing with respect to load balancing. It sounded like they expected the problem to be temporary as they worked out the kinks in their new load balancing configuration, however as far as I can tell the issue has never been resolved. I didn't follow up any further on the topic and instead switched to another mail client as a workaround. So this issue affects Alpine users even when not running from a Dreamhost shell account -- it affects me running alpine from my home (Mac) or work (Ubuntu/Mint/other Linux) systems as well. My suspicion is that Dreamhost's load-balancing configuration is dropping idle IMAP connections. I suspect most IMAP client software momentarily makes IMAP connections, checks for new mail/etc, and closes the connection, but that Alpine opens the IMAP connection and expects to keep it open for the duration of the session, leaving it idle most of the time. However that is all just speculation on my part. Thanks, Brent On 12/23/2014 01:25 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote: > Brent, > You are a prince. > Dreamhost is stumped by the problem as well. I understand that alpine > is the only mail client they provide on their servers, ours is hosting > plan for our media nonprofit organization...so we cannot just change > clients. > I am so happy to know it is not just me though! > Hopefully someone here can give me enough firm information to share > with dreamhost. They are now using ubintu and actually > moved our account on to the server where mail and alpine reside in an > effort to fix the problem. > That folder to restart the inbox may be afine last resort. > Thanks for providing a bit of peace for me on this. > Kare > > > On Tue, 23 Dec 2014, Brent Casavant wrote: > >> For what it's worth I've had this same problem ever since my hosting >> provider (dreamhost.com) implemented a load balancer in front of >> their IMAP servers over a year ago. It effectively made alpine unusable >> for me. As a result I've finally given in and (usually) use Thunderbird >> these days, which is my work-around until such time as I get off my lazy >> duff and migrate to another hosting provider. >> >> Within Alpine the best method I've found to deal with the situation >> is to go to the folder list and then re-select the INBOX. Annoying, >> but it works. >> >> I'm not sure why this affects Alpine but apparently not other email >> clients -- or at least the few I've tried. >> >> I know that's not of much help, but maybe it helps to know you're not >> alone in this frustration? >> >> Thanks, >> Brent >> >> On 12/23/2014 12:57 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote: >>> Hi, >>> Here is the timestamped latest file. I did not visit any links this >>> time, simply read and wrote emails. >>> there is a line at the end saying my mail was turned off? >>> As expressed, the firefox idea is useless. First it has nothing to do >>> with the time out issue, and second dreamhost does not provide this >>> browser on the shell aspect of their service. that is where I am using >>> alpine, and I understand firefox cannot be configured on shell >>> services. >>> Anyway, thoughts on the latest example. >>> Karen >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Alpine-info mailing list >>> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >>> http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >>> >> >> -- >> Brent Casavant >> bcasavan@angeltread.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Alpine-info mailing list >> Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> >> >> -- Brent Casavant bcasavan@angeltread.org From klewellen at shellworld.net Tue Dec 23 12:00:28 2014 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> Message-ID: Fantastic! Let me send this information. Christopher, who is head of tech support is managing this for me because this is actually a problem for which they must find a solution. The shell service lets them provide ADA based solutions for which they are legally obligated. I will share your name and the wisdom you are providing below...it makes allot of sense actually. We have alpine here at shellworld, another shell service but using freebsd instead of the ubintu environment, and this load issue is not happening here. Thanks so much, Kare On Tue, 23 Dec 2014, Brent Casavant wrote: > If Dreamhost is really interested in solving this problem, I'd be > more than happy to be a test dummy for them. Feel free to pass along > my name to them, and let them know it started happening when they > implemented load balancers on their mail systems. For me this > begin toward mid-to-late February of 2014. > > I communicated with their support staff about this issue on March 3, > receiving a response on March 5, where they detailed what they were > doing with respect to load balancing. It sounded like they expected > the problem to be temporary as they worked out the kinks in their > new load balancing configuration, however as far as I can tell the > issue has never been resolved. I didn't follow up any further on > the topic and instead switched to another mail client as a workaround. > > So this issue affects Alpine users even when not running from a > Dreamhost shell account -- it affects me running alpine from my > home (Mac) or work (Ubuntu/Mint/other Linux) systems as well. > > My suspicion is that Dreamhost's load-balancing configuration is dropping > idle IMAP connections. I suspect most IMAP client software momentarily > makes IMAP connections, checks for new mail/etc, and closes the connection, > but that Alpine opens the IMAP connection and expects to keep it open > for the duration of the session, leaving it idle most of the time. However > that is all just speculation on my part. > > Thanks, > Brent > > On 12/23/2014 01:25 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote: >> Brent, >> You are a prince. >> Dreamhost is stumped by the problem as well. I understand that alpine >> is the only mail client they provide on their servers, ours is hosting >> plan for our media nonprofit organization...so we cannot just change >> clients. >> I am so happy to know it is not just me though! >> Hopefully someone here can give me enough firm information to share >> with dreamhost. They are now using ubintu and actually >> moved our account on to the server where mail and alpine reside in an >> effort to fix the problem. >> That folder to restart the inbox may be afine last resort. >> Thanks for providing a bit of peace for me on this. >> Kare >> >> >> On Tue, 23 Dec 2014, Brent Casavant wrote: >> >> > For what it's worth I've had this same problem ever since my hosting >> > provider (dreamhost.com) implemented a load balancer in front of >> > their IMAP servers over a year ago. It effectively made alpine unusable >> > for me. As a result I've finally given in and (usually) use Thunderbird >> > these days, which is my work-around until such time as I get off my lazy >> > duff and migrate to another hosting provider. >> > >> > Within Alpine the best method I've found to deal with the situation >> > is to go to the folder list and then re-select the INBOX. Annoying, >> > but it works. >> > >> > I'm not sure why this affects Alpine but apparently not other email >> > clients -- or at least the few I've tried. >> > >> > I know that's not of much help, but maybe it helps to know you're not >> > alone in this frustration? >> > >> > Thanks, >> > Brent >> > >> > On 12/23/2014 12:57 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote: >> > > Hi, >> > > Here is the timestamped latest file. I did not visit any links this >> > > time, simply read and wrote emails. >> > > there is a line at the end saying my mail was turned off? >> > > As expressed, the firefox idea is useless. First it has nothing to >> > > do >> > > with the time out issue, and second dreamhost does not provide this >> > > browser on the shell aspect of their service. that is where I am >> > > using >> > > alpine, and I understand firefox cannot be configured on shell >> > > services. >> > > Anyway, thoughts on the latest example. >> > > Karen >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Alpine-info mailing list >> > > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> > > http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> > > >> > >> > -- >> > Brent Casavant >> > bcasavan@angeltread.org >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Alpine-info mailing list >> > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> > http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info >> > >> > >> > > > -- > Brent Casavant > bcasavan@angeltread.org > > From jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 04:11:03 2014 From: jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com (James Freer) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile Message-ID: I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the .pine-passfile. It seems to ignore it's existance which seems strange. Just wondering if any other Fedora users have had the same problem. It is version alpine 2.11 and I think I was using an earlier version in the other distro - perhaps that's the problem I don't know. So far for me alpine has worked perfectly. thanks james From unrtst at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 10:12:54 2014 From: unrtst at gmail.com (Joshua Miller) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, James Freer wrote: > > I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the .pine-passfile. > It seems to ignore it's existance which seems strange. Just wondering if > any other Fedora users have had the same problem. > > I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but try running this: alpine -h | grep passfile If you get a result such as: -passfile Set the password file to something other ... then passfile support should be available in your version of alpine. Next step would then be to troubleshoot further, possibly using the debug options ("-d 9") and looking at it to see why it's not reading your passfile. If you got no output from "alpine -h | grep passfile", then your version of alpine was probably compiled without passfile support. You'll need to find one that includes passfile support, or recompile it yourself (it's not as hard as it may sound). HTH, -- Josh I. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 13:05:19 2014 From: jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com (James Freer) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 29 December 2014 at 18:12, Joshua Miller wrote: > On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, James Freer > wrote: >> >> I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the .pine-passfile. >> It seems to ignore it's existance which seems strange. Just wondering if any >> other Fedora users have had the same problem. >> > > I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but try running this: > > alpine -h | grep passfile > > If you get a result such as: Hi Joshua > -passfile Set the password file to > something other Yes that is what I got. Fedora pride themselves in being technical! So the next step is called for. I have used Alpine in a different distro from xubuntu which is what I used to use and not had any problems. i did my pinerc file over two years ago and haven't touched it. > ... then passfile support should be available in your version of alpine. > Next step would then be to troubleshoot further, possibly using the debug > options ("-d 9") and looking at it to see why it's not reading your > passfile. debugging - I hate it. I've trying to get an HP scanner to work with their setup file and ...... agh. I'll have to use the gui for a while until I get round to it. I've been using linux for about 8 years but troubleshooting isn't my forte. Many thanks james From jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 13:14:22 2014 From: jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com (James Freer) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 29 December 2014 at 21:05, James Freer wrote: > On 29 December 2014 at 18:12, Joshua Miller wrote: >> On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, James Freer >> wrote: >>> >>> I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the .pine-passfile. >>> It seems to ignore it's existance which seems strange. Just wondering if any >>> other Fedora users have had the same problem. >>> >> >> I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but try running this: >> >> alpine -h | grep passfile >> >> If you get a result such as: > > Hi Joshua >> -passfile Set the password file to >> something other > > Yes that is what I got. Fedora pride themselves in being technical! So > the next step is called for. I have used Alpine in a different distro > from xubuntu which is what I used to use and not had any problems. i > did my pinerc file over two years ago and haven't touched it. > >> ... then passfile support should be available in your version of alpine. >> Next step would then be to troubleshoot further, possibly using the debug >> options ("-d 9") and looking at it to see why it's not reading your >> passfile. > > debugging - I hate it. I've trying to get an HP scanner to work with > their setup file and ...... agh. I'll have to use the gui for a while > until I get round to it. I've been using linux for about 8 years but > troubleshooting isn't my forte. > > Many thanks > james Just been trying again - it must be some Fedora 'wise'. Simply doesn't find the passfile. james From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Mon Dec 29 14:41:34 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Dec 2014, James Freer wrote: > From: James Freer > To: Joshua Miller > Cc: Alpine Info > Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2014 21:14:22 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile > > On 29 December 2014 at 21:05, James Freer wrote: > > On 29 December 2014 at 18:12, Joshua Miller wrote: > >> On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, James Freer > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the > >>> .pine-passfile. It seems to ignore it's existance which seems > >>> strange. Just wondering if any other Fedora users have had the > >>> same problem. > >> > >> > >> I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but try running > >> this: > >> > >> alpine -h | grep passfile > >> > >> If you get a result such as: > > > > Hi Joshua > >> -passfile Set the password file to > >> something other > > > > Yes that is what I got. Fedora pride themselves in being > > technical! So the next step is called for. I have used Alpine in > > a different distro from xubuntu which is what I used to use and > > not had any problems. i did my pinerc file over two years ago > > and haven't touched it. > > > >> ... then passfile support should be available in your version > >> of alpine. Next step would then be to troubleshoot further, > >> possibly using the debug options ("-d 9") and looking at it to > >> see why it's not reading your passfile. > > > > debugging - I hate it. I've trying to get an HP scanner to work > > with their setup file and ...... agh. I'll have to use the gui > > for a while until I get round to it. I've been using linux for > > about 8 years but troubleshooting isn't my forte. > > Just been trying again - it must be some Fedora 'wise'. Simply doesn't > find the passfile. Don't use Fedora, so can't comment on any specifics. But here's a few things you might check. (1) The default password file may be different than elsewhere. So try using "alpine -passfile ...". Note the requirement for a fully-qualified filename. I found that: alpine -passfile .pine-password alpine -passfile ./.pine-password didn't work and needed to use: alpine -passfile $HOME/.pine-password (2) Check the file permissions on ".pine-password". They need to be restrictive, with only you having access. Ie the permissions should look like "-rw-------". (3) If you're starting from scratch, alpine won't create ".pine-password" for you. It should already exist as an empty file with the correct permissions. -- Dennis Davis From chappa at gmx.com Mon Dec 29 16:16:49 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Dec 2014, James Freer wrote: > I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the .pine-passfile. > It seems to ignore it's existance which seems strange. Just wondering if > any other Fedora users have had the same problem. James, there is no standard name for the password file, I do not know the name that Fedora uses, but given that your version was build with one, here is how you can get the expected name. run the command $ strings alpine look in the output the line after the one that says Looking for passfile "%s" the name that appears there will be the name that is expected for the password file; however, you can always use the -passfile option to specify the location of your password file, in case you do not want to use the default. If you use S/MIME, alpine will encrypt your password file using your private key, and in order to decrypt it you will be asked for the password of the key. Decryption will happen in memory so your password file will never be decrypted again on disk. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From unrtst at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 16:44:46 2014 From: unrtst at gmail.com (Joshua Miller) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 5:41 PM, Dennis Davis wrote: > > On Mon, 29 Dec 2014, James Freer wrote: > > > From: James Freer > > To: Joshua Miller > > Cc: Alpine Info > > Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2014 21:14:22 > > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile > > > > On 29 December 2014 at 21:05, James Freer > wrote: > > > On 29 December 2014 at 18:12, Joshua Miller wrote: > > >> On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, James Freer < > jessejazza3.uk@gmail.com> > > >> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the > > >>> .pine-passfile. It seems to ignore it's existance which seems > > >>> strange. Just wondering if any other Fedora users have had the > > >>> same problem. > > >> > > >> > > >> I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but try running > > >> this: > > >> > > >> alpine -h | grep passfile > > >> > > >> If you get a result such as: > > > > > > Hi Joshua > > >> -passfile Set the password file to > > >> something other > > > > > > Yes that is what I got. Fedora pride themselves in being > > > technical! So the next step is called for. I have used Alpine in > > > a different distro from xubuntu which is what I used to use and > > > not had any problems. i did my pinerc file over two years ago > > > and haven't touched it. > > > > > >> ... then passfile support should be available in your version > > >> of alpine. Next step would then be to troubleshoot further, > > >> possibly using the debug options ("-d 9") and looking at it to > > >> see why it's not reading your passfile. > > > > > > debugging - I hate it. I've trying to get an HP scanner to work > > > with their setup file and ...... agh. I'll have to use the gui > > > for a while until I get round to it. I've been using linux for > > > about 8 years but troubleshooting isn't my forte. > > > > Just been trying again - it must be some Fedora 'wise'. Simply doesn't > > find the passfile. > > Don't use Fedora, so can't comment on any specifics. But here's a > few things you might check. > > (1) The default password file may be different than elsewhere. > So try using "alpine -passfile ...". Note the requirement for a > fully-qualified filename. I found that: > > alpine -passfile .pine-password > alpine -passfile ./.pine-password > > didn't work and needed to use: > > alpine -passfile $HOME/.pine-password > > (2) Check the file permissions on ".pine-password". They need to be > restrictive, with only you having access. Ie the permissions should > look like "-rw-------". > > (3) If you're starting from scratch, alpine won't create > ".pine-password" for you. It should already exist as an empty file > with the correct permissions. > > To summarize and provide an example you can just cp/paste into the terminal: cd ~ touch .pine-passfile chmod 600 .pine-passfile alpine -passfile ~/.pine-passfile If that works, add an alias so you don't have to retype it: alias alpine="alpine -passfile ~/.pine-passfile" echo 'alias alpine="alpine -passfile ~/.pine-passfile"' >> ~/.bashrc ... then just type "alpine" as normal Chappa's answer could alternatively be used. If you find that via: strings `which alpine` | grep -A5 -B5 "Looking for passfile" ... then just alter the steps to: touch {whatevever_file_you_just_found} chmod 600 {that_same_file} ... and start alpine without the -passfile option and it *should* work. Testing with the option (first example) is probably more thorough, since you're not guessing at all at what the name of the passfile is. HTH, -- Josh I. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From poobah at ruptured-duck.com Mon Dec 29 19:45:46 2014 From: poobah at ruptured-duck.com (Bob Bernstein) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Dec 2014, Joshua Miller wrote: > I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but > try running this: > > alpine -h | grep passfile > > If you get a result such as: > > -passfile Set the > password file to something other May I humbly submit that the important part of the above is: "". The complete pathname to the file must be specified, such as: c:/home/buckybeaver/BuckysAlpinePassfile hth -- "Natasha! First we shoot jet, then we go after moose and squirrel." From dennisdavis at fastmail.fm Tue Dec 30 11:09:24 2014 From: dennisdavis at fastmail.fm (Dennis Davis) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Dec 2014, Brent Casavant wrote: > From: Brent Casavant > To: Karen Lewellen > Cc: alpine-info@u.washington.edu > Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2014 19:41:01 > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. ... > My suspicion is that Dreamhost's load-balancing configuration is > dropping idle IMAP connections. That sounds possible. > I suspect most IMAP client software momentarily makes IMAP > connections, checks for new mail/etc, and closes the connection, That's likely to lead to constant requests for re-authentication, This will be obvious to the user, unless the email client is caching the authentication credentials as part of the session. > but that Alpine opens the IMAP connection and expects to keep it > open for the duration of the session, leaving it idle most of the > time. However that is all just speculation on my part. The Alpine IMAP connection is unlikely to be idle for "long" periods, even if the user is inactive. This is because Alpine peridically checks for new email, which will give activity to the IMAP connection. See the "Mail Check Interval" variable in Alpine's configuration section. The help for this setting is worth reading. My configuration setting has: Mail Check Interval = so I'm just using the default. I've never had to alter this variable, so have little experience in its use. You could try reducing the value of this setting if you think your IMAP server is agressively closing "idle" IMAP connections. I've no idea if this will make a difference, but it's a quick and easy check to make. On an unrelated note, it seems the original correspondent (Karen Lewellen) is using pine4.64. The Message-ID's, eg: are rather a large clue. This is the last version of pine that was released and is now quite old. It may be worth looking for a recent version of alpine. The version of Unix I'm using has Alpine-2.11 available as a package. However I doubt that a recent version of Alpine will have any effect on the above "dropped connections" problem. -- Dennis Davis From klewellen at shellworld.net Tue Dec 30 11:43:22 2014 From: klewellen at shellworld.net (Karen Lewellen) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> Message-ID: Hi, Shellworld is not dreamhost. The problems with alpine are tied to a totally different address. actually it was recommended ages back that I reduce the check option you mention below. I did, making it 15 seconds. Indeed it had no impact on the problem. as for using alpine at shellworld, no thanks. Pine does the job for me and my experiences trying to make alpine work on my job are such to keep me using pine as long as shellworld, base din freebsd, gives me that choice lol. Karen On Tue, 30 Dec 2014, Dennis Davis wrote: > On Tue, 23 Dec 2014, Brent Casavant wrote: > >> From: Brent Casavant >> To: Karen Lewellen >> Cc: alpine-info@u.washington.edu >> Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2014 19:41:01 >> Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. > > ... > >> My suspicion is that Dreamhost's load-balancing configuration is >> dropping idle IMAP connections. > > That sounds possible. > >> I suspect most IMAP client software momentarily makes IMAP >> connections, checks for new mail/etc, and closes the connection, > > That's likely to lead to constant requests for re-authentication, > This will be obvious to the user, unless the email client is caching > the authentication credentials as part of the session. > >> but that Alpine opens the IMAP connection and expects to keep it >> open for the duration of the session, leaving it idle most of the >> time. However that is all just speculation on my part. > > The Alpine IMAP connection is unlikely to be idle for "long" > periods, even if the user is inactive. This is because Alpine > peridically checks for new email, which will give activity to the > IMAP connection. See the "Mail Check Interval" variable in Alpine's > configuration section. The help for this setting is worth reading. > > My configuration setting has: > > Mail Check Interval = > > so I'm just using the default. I've never had to alter this > variable, so have little experience in its use. > > You could try reducing the value of this setting if you think your > IMAP server is agressively closing "idle" IMAP connections. I've no > idea if this will make a difference, but it's a quick and easy check > to make. > > On an unrelated note, it seems the original correspondent (Karen > Lewellen) is using pine4.64. The Message-ID's, eg: > > > > are rather a large clue. > > This is the last version of pine that was released and is now quite > old. It may be worth looking for a recent version of alpine. The > version of Unix I'm using has Alpine-2.11 available as a package. > However I doubt that a recent version of Alpine will have any effect > on the above "dropped connections" problem. > -- > Dennis Davis > _______________________________________________ > Alpine-info mailing list > Alpine-info@u.washington.edu > http://mailman13.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info > > From chappa at gmx.com Tue Dec 30 13:58:09 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Dec 2014, Dennis Davis wrote: [... omitted all possible help from Dennis] Dennis, Dreamhost already solved the problem for her. They gave her access to the server. However, Karen does not understand that what she has to do now is to configure her inbox-path locally, and that she needs to ask Dreamhost for the place where her inbox is, and delete her current inbox-path, which is of the form {some.server}inbox. I already suggested to her how to do this, but she declined to do it on the grounds that it was too risky for her to remove the inbox-path without checking the imap problem first. Maybe you can explain to her why she needs to do so, I failed to get across to her. The only thing that could go wrong, is that since Dreamhost uses Dovecot, I am afraid her e-mail will be in the Maildir format, which Alpine does not do, so I am thinking that they (Dreamhost) will have to patch their Alpine for her to be able to read her mail locally and avoid all of this issue. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/ From jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com Tue Dec 30 14:29:19 2014 From: jessejazza3.uk at gmail.com (James Freer) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Dec 2014, Joshua Miller wrote: > On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 5:41 PM, Dennis Davis > wrote: > On Mon, 29 Dec 2014, James Freer wrote: > > > From: James Freer > > To: Joshua Miller > > Cc: Alpine Info > > Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2014 21:14:22 > > Subject: Re: [Alpine-info] Fedora F21 - .pine-passfile > > > > On 29 December 2014 at 21:05, James Freer > wrote: > > > On 29 December 2014 at 18:12, Joshua Miller > wrote: > > >> On Mon, Dec 29, 2014 at 7:11 AM, James Freer > > > >> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> I have just started using Fedora and it doesn't like the > > >>> .pine-passfile.? It seems to ignore it's existance which > seems > > >>> strange. Just wondering if any other Fedora users have had > the > > >>> same problem. > > >> > > >> > > >> I can't comment on Fedora (don't use it here), but try > running > > >> this: > > >> > > >>? ? ? alpine -h | grep passfile > > >> > > >> If you get a result such as: > > > > > > Hi Joshua > > >>? ? ? -passfile ? ?Set the > password file to > > >> something other > > > > > > Yes that is what I got. Fedora pride themselves in being > > > technical! So the next step is called for. I have used > Alpine in > > > a different distro from xubuntu which is what I used to use > and > > > not had any problems. i did my pinerc file over two years > ago > > > and haven't touched it. > > > > > >> ... then passfile support should be available in your > version > > >> of alpine.? Next step would then be to troubleshoot > further, > > >> possibly using the debug options ("-d 9") and looking at it > to > > >> see why it's not reading your passfile. > > > > > > debugging - I hate it. I've trying to get an HP scanner to > work > > > with their setup file and ...... agh. I'll have to use the > gui > > > for a while until I get round to it. I've been using linux > for > > > about 8 years but troubleshooting isn't my forte. > > > > Just been trying again - it must be some Fedora 'wise'. Simply > doesn't > > find the passfile. > > Don't use Fedora, so can't comment on any specifics.? But here's a > few things you might check. > > (1) The default password file may be different than elsewhere. > So try using "alpine -passfile ...".? Note the requirement for a > fully-qualified filename.? I found that: > > alpine -passfile .pine-password > alpine -passfile ./.pine-password > > didn't work and needed to use: > > alpine -passfile $HOME/.pine-password > > (2) Check the file permissions on ".pine-password".? They need to be > restrictive, with only you having access.? Ie the permissions should > look like "-rw-------". > > (3) If you're starting from scratch, alpine won't create > ".pine-password" for you.? It should already exist as an empty file > with the correct permissions. > > > To summarize and provide an example you can just cp/paste into the terminal: > > cd ~ > touch .pine-passfile > chmod 600 .pine-passfile > alpine?-passfile ~/.pine-passfile > > If that works, add an alias so you don't have to retype it: > alias alpine="alpine -passfile ~/.pine-passfile" > echo 'alias alpine="alpine -passfile ~/.pine-passfile"' >> ~/.bashrc > ... then just type "alpine" as normal > > Chappa's answer could alternatively be used. If you find that via: > > strings `which alpine` | grep -A5 -B5 "Looking for passfile" > > ... then just alter the steps to: > > touch {whatevever_file_you_just_found} > chmod 600 {that_same_file} > > ... and start alpine without the -passfile option and it *should* work. > Testing with the option (first example) is probably more thorough, since > you're not guessing at all at what the name of the passfile is. Joshua, Eduardo, Bob, Dennis Many thanks for your help. What I didn't say was that my Fedora username and password were the same. Thus the user permissions haven't changed, and my .pine-passfile are in 'home'. I think it's a Fedora thing. They seem to do odd things! I keep all data (work files, music etc) on a separate disk, as I have in the past done 6 month upgrades and so preferred to keep a disk for the system (waste of space when it's a 500gb and I use about 5%). I use FAT32 on the spare disks as I need to sometimes access through windows. In the file manager when I mounted the disk I found the action needed to be done as root. This can be done but I took a while reading but found other things I didn't like about Fedora... got Fed-up (LOL pun intended!). I have been using xubuntu for several years now but have found it's glitches are increasing. So I looked for an alternative BUT returned. I used to do an annual update which I think is a good balance but since they changed their maintenance period to 9 months for non LTS release - the 6 month update got a bit annoying. LTS is fine but in the 2nd year it's a bit behind on apps upgrades - so why they have increased to 5 years i don't know. It seems they are following the lead by Mint which appears to be turning the distro into a point release every two years rather than a rolling release - presumably for stability. Thanks james From jason-alpine-info at shalott.net Tue Dec 30 14:39:18 2014 From: jason-alpine-info at shalott.net (Jason) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> Message-ID: > since Dreamhost uses Dovecot, I am afraid her e-mail will be in the > Maildir format, which Alpine does not do, so I am thinking that they > (Dreamhost) will have to patch their Alpine for her to be able to read > her mail locally and avoid all of this issue. An alternative, that doesn't require patching, is to use alpine's imap-over-rsh support to call Dovecot's imap engine directly. This bypasses any auth or network issues, but still lets you use their IMAP setup to abstract the mailbox storage format and location, locking, etc. This is how I configure my mail hosts: new/home/jason-17631: egrep 'inbox|imap' /etc/pine.conf inbox-path={localhost/novalidate-cert}INBOX rsh-path=/usr/local/bin/pine-local-imap new/home/jason-17632: cat /usr/local/bin/pine-local-imap #!/bin/sh cd ${HOME}/Maildir/ || exit 1 exec /usr/libexec/dovecot/imap 2>/dev/null -Jason From chappa at gmx.com Tue Dec 30 22:53:21 2014 From: chappa at gmx.com (Eduardo Chappa) Date: Tue Jun 12 15:14:59 2018 Subject: [Alpine-info] latest debug file. In-Reply-To: References: <5499BE72.1040102@angeltread.org> <5499C54D.9000509@angeltread.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Dec 2014, Jason wrote: > An alternative, that doesn't require patching, is to use alpine's > imap-over-rsh support to call Dovecot's imap engine directly. This is a great idea. I hope Karen gets from your message what she needs to do now to configure Alpine. -- Eduardo http://patches.freeiz.com/alpine/